Guest Host, Alex McFarland, is joined by Bunni Pounds, Founder and President of Christians Engaged

Transcribed with OpenAI Whisper (base.en). Timestamps are approximate. Lightly cleaned for readability; quotations from on-air callers may include filler words. Use the audio player above for the authoritative recording.

1. 0:00Darkness is not an affirmative force.
2. 0:03It simply reoccupies the space vacated by the light.
3. 0:06This is the Hamilton Corner on American Family Radio.
4. 0:11It should be uncomfortable for a believer to live as a hypocrite.
5. 0:15Delivery people out of the bondage of mainstream media.
6. 0:18And the philosophies of this world.
7. 0:20God has called you and me to be his ambassador.
8. 0:24Even in this dark moment.
9. 0:26Let's not miss our moment.
10. 0:28and now, the Hamilton Corner.
11. 0:33Should Christians speak out about politics?
12. 0:36Does the church have a role or an influence to exert in government and culture?
13. 0:43Hi, Alex McFarland.
14. 0:44You're very honored to be sitting in for Abe Hamilton tonight on the Hamilton Corner.
15. 0:49It's my privilege somewhat frequently.
16. 0:52I sit in while Abe may be traveling and tonight is one of those nights.
17. 0:57I really believe that this could be one of the most significant consequential shows that
18. 1:05you listen to in many a day.
19. 1:07I've got with me bunny pounds and she is a voice, a leader, an author, her book, Jesus
20. 1:15and Politics.
21. 1:17One woman's walk with God in a mud-slinging profession and she's insightful and we always
22. 1:25learn from her when we have the time to converse. Later on we'll take questions as well and maybe
23. 1:31you want to weigh in and ask a question about this. But first of all welcome Buddy Pounds and
24. 1:38thank you for making time to be with us today. Alex, really great to be with you. So thankful
25. 1:48for you and this ministry and your voice of bringing the biblical worldview to every Christian in the
26. 1:53country we're thankful. Well, amen. Well, listen, I want, before we get in, there's
27. 2:00so many things I want to ask you. I want you to give your website and folks, after
28. 2:04you hear Bunny Pounds, you will want to access her content online and her book as
29. 2:10well. But where may people find you? Yeah, Christians engaged.org. Christians with
30. 2:17an S engaged with a D org. That's our main ministry website or my name, Bunny,
31. 2:23with an IBunnyPounds.com has even more stuff.
32. 2:27You know, when I was a youth pastor in Greensboro, North Carolina back in the 90s,
33. 2:33one of the things that we did, I think it was probably about 1997,
34. 2:39we brought David Barton to Greensboro. You know David Barton and
35. 2:43Wall Builders. Oh yeah. And it was phenomenal. And we've
36. 2:48known him all these years. But my point is when you look at the history of the country
37. 2:54really up until the mid-20th century, America was so overtly steeped in the Bible, biblical
38. 3:06principles, Christians being involved, presidents that would talk about Jesus, and we were an
39. 3:14unapologetically Christian culture and government.
40. 3:18And then nowadays, like every week of the year bunny, I get reprimanded by ministers who
41. 3:24email me and they'll say, Alex McFarland, you're a pastor.
42. 3:29You have no business talking about politics.
43. 3:32You're called to preach the gospel.
44. 3:34Stay out of this thing about government and culture and politics.
45. 3:37How did we get this dichotomy?
46. 3:41We were overtly Christian and now it's almost assumed that the Christians have no right
47. 3:49to speak about government and culture.
48. 3:51How did this bifurcation happen, Bunny?
49. 3:57Well somewhere we decided to buy into the lie, Alex, that some things are sacred and some
50. 4:02things are secular and it's really not the word of God.
51. 4:07Jesus, when he walked on the earth, talked about everything.
52. 4:12He talked to the people in the temple, but he also talked to the people in the market.
53. 4:17I was just, I'm doing a Bible study right now on my podcast, Jesus from America.
54. 4:22I'm pre-recording the book of Philippians.
55. 4:25And it just hit me even as the Apostle Paul was talking about the women that were, you know,
56. 4:31influential in the church of Philippi.
57. 4:34You know, we see Lydia, we see all these merchants and business owners and et cetera.
58. 4:42You know, it really kind of frustrates me sometimes with pastors because they want it.
59. 4:47They'll encourage the businessmen or women in their churches to go take Jesus to their
60. 4:51boardrooms or public educators to take Jesus to their classrooms.
61. 4:56But when you start talking about politics, oh, let's take Jesus to our city council or
62. 5:00our school board or pray for our member of Congress or support a candidate.
63. 5:05They like freak out, right?
64. 5:08Oh, yeah.
65. 5:09And it's just, you know, we have to realize that the God wants our voices in every space.
66. 5:16My story is I was a homeschooling mom that got active 20 years ago and I wanted to make
67. 5:21a difference and I saw that I could make a difference in some homeschool issues and some
68. 5:27on the life issue and the sanctity of human life.
69. 5:30And I got involved in party politics.
70. 5:33Oh, horrible, muddy, yucky.
71. 5:36Nobody wants to do that, right?
72. 5:38But I realized I could actually shift the party platforms in my state and I can make
73. 5:44it more biblical.
74. 5:45And then I realized I could actually support candidates that held biblical values and would
75. 5:51push those values if they got into office.
76. 5:54Then I realized that I could be a staffer and a consultant and walk with members of Congress
77. 5:59and give them wisdom and help for their life as they served in those places.
78. 6:05tell me we can't be missionaries in those places of influence, we can.
79. 6:10Well, we can, and very often, and I know, you know, I started out very respectfully calling
80. 6:18and dialoguing with elected officials in my home state of North Carolina and then senators
81. 6:24and leaders that went to Washington.
82. 6:26But very often, I've had congressmen and senators say, you know, you're the only constituent
83. 6:33that called. So Reverend McFarland, what you got, nobody else has called me, so I will
84. 6:40listen to you. My point being, one voice can really make a difference, can't they?
85. 6:47Oh, 100%. I could tell you story after story, Alex, of the man or woman that decided to go
86. 6:53to the community college board of trustee meetings, and nobody went, and then they decided to
87. 6:59to write a blog on how they were raising taxes.
88. 7:02And then they decide to run for that board of trustees.
89. 7:05And how they shifted tax rates and how they,
90. 7:09you know, in our city in Rowlett, Texas,
91. 7:11one pastor who got involved with Christians engaged,
92. 7:15started working with five or six other pastors,
93. 7:18got all of our products, our Get Out the Vote system,
94. 7:22our education products into five or six churches.
95. 7:25He started putting his members from an Assembly of God
96. 7:28church on boards and commissions in our city. Then he started running people for
97. 7:33City Council. They they flipped the City Council for putting more conservatives on
98. 7:40that City Council and then got rid of the DEI program in our city. So that's how one
99. 7:46pastor, one person can make a difference. We've seen that over and over again. I
100. 7:51can tell you stories all day long. Wonderful. Well mint, you mentioned
101. 7:56Christians engaged. Tell about that. And I want to ask, is this in all 50 states?
102. 8:03Yes, yes. So, yeah, I spent about 16 years in political consulting working for members of Congress and candidates, a couple of my former
103. 8:13candidates are in the cabinet now, Lee Zeldin and Sean Duffy were two of my former candidates.
104. 8:18But I ran for Congress 2018 and then at the end of that realized that I really felt like the Lord was telling me that he was going to
105. 8:27waken his church in the days ahead and to build systems to help mobilize the body of Christ.
106. 8:33Because it's not good enough, Alex, just to talk about Christians praying and voting.
107. 8:39We need to be reminded. You know, we're all busy. We've got kids with soccer games and we've got church activities and we've got businesses to run.
108. 8:47So how can we help motivate and create a call to action for every Christian in this country that would actually help them do what they're
109. 8:55Called to do that's what we set out to do with Christians engage
110. 8:59And I believe we've done it. We actually track every election in the country and we in a data secured system
111. 9:07That's only for the body of Christ
112. 9:09We push people to pray every Monday for their elected officials in for America. We create videos
113. 9:16those scripture prayer prompts and then we track every election and push out four texts
114. 9:22and four emails around every special election, primary, federal election, state election and
115. 9:28on the local elections we talk about them from a statewide basis.
116. 9:32So we've got local elections happening right now in our state of Texas and we're pushing
117. 9:38out five step guides to your local election and helping Christians vote in those nonpartisan
118. 9:43elections.
119. 9:45We believe that if Christians start doing that, we could impact our communities for the long
120. 9:50term.
121. 9:51And then we also build about $300,000 of on-demand video curriculum teaching Christians how to
122. 9:57engage in civics, in running for office, local government, and biblical worldview topics.
123. 10:03It's been fun.
124. 10:04Amen.
125. 10:05Amen.
126. 10:06Hey, by the way, folks, I've got the great privilege of being on the Hamilton corner again tomorrow
127. 10:11evening and we'll have on Kathy Branzel, the president of National Day of Prayer.
128. 10:17By the way, NDP National Day of Prayer is coming up on May 1st and I want to
129. 10:22encourage you. They've got like 19,000 gatherings. That's so wonderful and be
130. 10:31a part of it no matter where you are in America. There is an opportunity for you
131. 10:35to be a part of National Day of Prayer and we'll talk about that some tomorrow.
132. 10:39But, Bunny, my heart is just so thrilled to hear how God is using you.
133. 10:45And, yeah, I mean, even early in America, one of the great leaders, Daniel Webster, early
134. 10:54in American life, he basically said, why should we let the pagans chart our future?
135. 11:01And the way he phrased it, it's so beautiful.
136. 11:04He said he wanted the evangelical volume in every city, town and hamlet.
137. 11:11Now that was the Bible because if we don't proactively share truth, moral boundaries,
138. 11:18and yes the gospel, then a false pagan, worldly worldview will take control.
139. 11:26So I think we have a great opportunity not only to walk with the Lord, grow in the Lord,
140. 11:34help our country know who Jesus is and his principles and his word shape what our culture
141. 11:41is like.
142. 11:42Yeah, we've got two things here, Alex.
143. 11:46We really encourage people and this is part of the reason why I wrote my book, Jesus in
144. 11:50politics is we need to get every Christian praying, voting and engaging on an ongoing
145. 11:55basis.
146. 11:56We absolutely need more Christian consultants.
147. 12:00We need more Christian staffers.
148. 12:01We need more Christians running for office.
149. 12:03We need more Christians advocating for our values and going to their city council meetings.
150. 12:08We need all that.
151. 12:10But we can't cease to be Christians when we're doing that.
152. 12:14We have to operate with boldness and courage and we need to operate within the sermon and
153. 12:18the mount as well.
154. 12:20So part of what we're trying to do with Christians engage is create a civic engagement ministry
155. 12:26that will help pastors.
156. 12:27We have a whole pastors toolkit.
157. 12:29We help pastors and churches do voter registration, voter mobilization and education around the
158. 12:35country.
159. 12:37And we are in all 50 states.
160. 12:39We work with our family policy councils on the ground around the country.
161. 12:44And we also, all of our technology and stuff is all 50 states that we track.
162. 12:50But we also have an opportunity to mentor and train and disciple young people and people
163. 12:56that are engaging in politics on how to do this in a right fashion, how to do it with knowledge,
164. 13:03first of all, with a prayer for heart and to keep our integrity because I think you've seen this
165. 13:10Alex in our movement sometimes. People create politics as an idol in their heart or they start
166. 13:18attacking people in a way that doesn't look too Christian. It's one thing to stand up for your
167. 13:23values, but it's another thing to start attacking people personally. So we try to
168. 13:28train Christians how to stand up for truth, how to speak the truth in love, but also
169. 13:34to navigate these political mind fields so that they can really make a difference.
170. 13:38Well, I'm so glad you say that because, you know, a person to be loved is more
171. 13:47important than an argument to be won. Amen. And in the spirited discourse, I don't like
172. 13:57wokeness. I don't like some of the ideologies that are markism, socialism, moral libertarianism,
173. 14:08the LGBTQ trans agendas. But you know what, the thing is that the activists in those realms
174. 14:14are people that are deceived.
175. 14:17And yet we need to stand for truth and fight back error,
176. 14:21but let's pray and live so that these people
177. 14:25can come out of the darkness into the light.
178. 14:28And we can't win them if we're cruel to them.
179. 14:33But hey, we've got to break.
180. 14:35Bunny Pounds, I could not be more excited.
181. 14:38The guests that we have, Bunny Pounds, Jesus and politics,
182. 14:42plus your calls and questions on this edition of the Hamilton Corner, Alex McFarland.
183. 14:47He's listening to the American Family Radio Network. Brief break, stay tuned more for God
184. 14:52and Country after this brief break. A discipleship minute with Joseph Parker.
185. 15:03How tragic it is when people who say they love Jesus will see the need, see the problems,
186. 15:10for whatever reason, pass by on the other side. Sometimes people may think, well,
187. 15:14That's not my problem and I don't want to be a victim like he was.
188. 15:18Well, that's a wrong perspective.
189. 15:21Some may think, well, I'm busy.
190. 15:22I've got other things to do.
191. 15:24Well, it's easy to say everybody's busy.
192. 15:27Everybody has something to do.
193. 15:28By the grace of God we see where God commended the Samaritan.
194. 15:31He too had something to do, but he took time.
195. 15:34He made time to stop and help with compassion.
196. 15:38Someone who'd been beat up and left for dead on the side of the road by the world.
197. 15:44You and I need to make time to live a life of compassion.
198. 15:48We're called to be the hands and feet of Jesus Christ in the world.
199. 15:53How important it is that we're faithful to do that.
200. 15:56This is what we're made for.
201. 16:05Shiting light into the darkness.
202. 16:07This is the Hamilton Quarter, an American family radio.
203. 16:12Welcome back to the program, Alex McFarland.
204. 16:14Hey, while we're talking about making a difference and being equipped and having our voice heard,
205. 16:20I want to remind you, please pray and attend if you're able the conversations that matter.
206. 16:27The speaker series that we start May 4th, so just a week from Sunday, Myrtle Beach, South
207. 16:32Carolina, we're at a wonderful theater down there.
208. 16:36My first speaker in person, not video, I'm talking live, Dinesh D'Souza, multiple number
209. 16:43one New York Times best-selling author renowned filmmaker, probably one of the
210. 16:49greatest political science voices. He served in the Reagan White House and
211. 16:55Dinesh will be there in person to speak and he'll have open mic Q&A. I mean think
212. 17:01about that. How often do you get the opportunity to ask questions of one of
213. 17:06the most astute? He's brilliant but he's funny too. He's very witty. Dinesh D'Souza,
214. 17:12conversations that matter and the website is AlexMcFarland.com slash
215. 17:18conversations. We would love to see you there on Sunday night May 4th. But with me
216. 17:24now also riveting communicator, inspiring speaker, Bunny Pounds, Jesus and
217. 17:30politics. And so much I want to ask you and we will take calls in a few moments.
218. 17:36But tell people about Christians engaged and give that website if you
219. 17:41with please, Bunny.
220. 17:43Yeah, we're here to help every Christian pray, vote,
221. 17:47and engage.
222. 17:48We have built a 50-state get-out-the-vote system,
223. 17:52a church outreach program, a young adult program.
224. 17:55We called 1630 for 16 to 30-year-olds.
225. 17:59We're taking 50 young people to Washington, DC,
226. 18:02this summer on scholarships.
227. 18:03So if you're 18 to 30-year-olds,
228. 18:06and you feel called the government politics and ministry,
229. 18:09We wanted to put you in the fire in Washington DC
230. 18:13for three and a half days.
231. 18:16We're raising up the next generation of leaders
232. 18:18and we have also created eight national products.
233. 18:23Amazing on-demand video curriculum
234. 18:25and we can also take these classes to each church
235. 18:29around the country.
236. 18:30So we are doing the stuff.
237. 18:33Alex and people can reach us at christiansengage.org
238. 18:37and take the pledge to pray, vote, and engage,
239. 18:40and you'll get in our system and see all the amazing events
240. 18:44and different things that we have going on.
241. 18:47Well, and as Americans, we have this incredible opportunity,
242. 18:53Lincoln referenced it in the Gettysburg Address,
243. 18:56and I want you to speak about this self-government.
244. 19:01Isn't that amazing?
245. 19:03So talk to us about the incredible God-ordained opportunity
246. 19:09that we US citizens have to participate in self-government.
247. 19:16Well, he set it up in the book of Genesis, Alex,
248. 19:20that we get to regulate ourself and govern ourself.
249. 19:25You know, God was after.
250. 19:27I love that he didn't create us as robots, right?
251. 19:30He wanted voluntary lovers,
252. 19:32people that would choose him.
253. 19:35And I love that our Constitution even,
254. 19:38as we're about to celebrate our
255. 19:39250th year birthday of America next year,
256. 19:43our Constitution of America was built
257. 19:46on liberty, justice, the rule of law.
258. 19:50And those processes came out of the Bible,
259. 19:53out of a biblical worldview.
260. 19:56And that's, I believe, why this Constitution
261. 20:00has lasted more than any other Constitution
262. 20:02world history. And I believe will last for years to come. But you know, as
263. 20:08individuals, we have a responsibility to choose the Lord to govern
264. 20:14our self rightly, and then to govern our families, then govern our churches,
265. 20:19and governments, real role is to step in when people are evil dovers,
266. 20:23when there is no justice, when their laws are being broken, to protect the
267. 20:30people from themselves. And so I love that the government is a God-ordained institution
268. 20:38as well as the church and as well as the family and as well as our relationships with the Lord
269. 20:43individually as well. I just, you know, I'm so edified listening to you and at what age did the
270. 20:54white bulb come on. I mean, have you always just been a civic minded Christian or how did God
271. 21:02birth within you this fire for God and country? Well, I became, I really had an experience with God
272. 21:11when I was 13 years old and became a radical evangelist in my public high school actually.
273. 21:19But I went to a Christian music concert years ago, I was a senior in high school and went to this
274. 21:25concert called Cornerstone Festival. I was actually just telling the story. Was that in Pennsylvania?
275. 21:31Yeah, yeah. And we're in this tent, right? There's all these vendors in ministry there. And this
276. 21:39group Operation Rescue was there and showing these really graphic videos of what abortion is. And
277. 21:48it was the first time I was really exposed to that as a young person. And I remember Alex,
278. 21:53I didn't put this in my book. I haven't really even talked about this, but I was telling this to a friend a few days ago and just reliving it.
279. 22:00I just remember standing there at that booth and just weeping over the slaughter of babies in the womb in our nation.
280. 22:09And that caused me when I went to Bible college at Christ for the nations a few years later, I joined the moral issues ministry and we would pray at abortion clinics.
281. 22:20and we would speak to people on the streets of Dallas and share the gospel.
282. 22:24And then, you know, I thought I was going to be a missionary to Latin America.
283. 22:29And then all of a sudden my best friend proposed over pancakes and I'm mirroring a pest control guy.
284. 22:35And having a pest control company and I'm like, OK, I guess I'm not going to Guatemala now.
285. 22:40I'm going to be in America and we started having little babies.
286. 22:44And I and I was trying to figure out how I could really make a difference.
287. 22:47And there was this woman on talk radio named Laura Ingraham.
288. 22:51Most of your listeners are probably heard of Laura and I got addicted to
289. 22:55listening to this crazy, funny woman named Laura Ingraham.
290. 22:58And that produced me really wanting to make a difference in politics and
291. 23:02government and going back to school and the rest is history.
292. 23:06Amen.
293. 23:08That is that is so wonderful.
294. 23:09I want to share a scripture and then I want your comment and please speak to
295. 23:15the pastors if you would because you know Bunny well back in 2016 Tony Perkins of
296. 23:23FRC call me he knows I'm from North Carolina hundred counties and I had preached
297. 23:30in 98 of the hundred counties in North Carolina most of the great big churches
298. 23:37and Tony Perkins he said Alex can you help us get some voters guide throughout
299. 23:42North Carolina. It was a nonpartisan, just to explain where the candidates were. So I
300. 23:48was like, sure, Tony, I got this, man. I'm a North Carolina boy. They love me here.
301. 23:54You know? So I called all these, I mean, I spent weeks calling all these pastors
302. 24:00where I had preached in these churches and the churches of North Carolina. And
303. 24:0590% of the pastors, they would go, oh, Alex, hey, now you know we're for you,
304. 24:12Alex. You know, you're hometown boy, but I don't touch politics. We're sorry, Alex. We cannot put
305. 24:20these voters' guides. And I mean, we're talking about life, the sanctity of life, you know, the nature
306. 24:27of marriage, the preservation of religious freedom. And I got to be honest, you know, I eventually we
307. 24:34got the voters' guides in maybe half of the churches. But my point is, sorry to take so long to set this
308. 24:41this up. What do you say to the pastors that offline, they'll say, Oh, hey, I'm for you.
309. 24:50I'm right there where you are, but I don't publicly go on record. And I, you know, how
310. 24:55do we get the spiritual leaders and the churches engaged when they seem too fearful to take a
311. 25:03public stand?
312. 25:07There's a couple things going on, Alex. After about 150 pastor meetings, the last few years
313. 25:13me and my vice president Ben Kwine have taken, I can tell you, I'm convinced more and more
314. 25:19every day that pastors are not afraid of separation of church and state and the Johnson
315. 25:23Amendment. Those are just paper tigers. They're not really worried about that. What they're
316. 25:28really worried about is one tithing member leaving their church. And when the average church
317. 25:36in America is under 250 people, every single one of those people sitting in those pews are
318. 25:42absolutely important to the pastor. You understand that as a pastor.
319. 25:46Yeah, sure.
320. 25:46So we have to reach them with that understanding. We have to
321. 25:51understand that they're terrified of the woman in their
322. 25:55congregation that's had an abortion, that when they start
323. 25:58talking about abortion, she's just going to get angry because
324. 26:02she's not healed. She hasn't been delivered or the man that's
325. 26:06paid for abortions that's never dealt with it, that they're
326. 26:09going to get so convicted, but they're not going to deal with it
327. 26:12that they're going to just run out the door with their checkbook, right?
328. 26:15So we have to help them take baby steps.
329. 26:20And I know that sounds kind of weird,
330. 26:22but I believe every pastor in this country can preach a sermon on pray,
331. 26:27vote, engage without splitting their church.
332. 26:30Okay, start with that.
333. 26:32Talk about the role of us praying for our elected officials and our government officials
334. 26:37out of First Timothy 2.
335. 26:38Then talk about the importance of loving our neighbors and electing righteous leaders and why that's important and should be part of our discipleship.
336. 26:47Then talk about engagement, which we're all every pastor in the country, Alex. I'm going on a rant here, but it's important.
337. 26:54They're going to all talk about taking Jesus out and being missionaries. When you walk out Sunday morning, go be a missionary.
338. 27:01You're on mission for God.
339. 27:03You're on mission for God, but man if you start talking about hey
340. 27:08I'm gonna go advocate for this biblical value or I'm gonna go run for city council or I'm gonna go take on the
341. 27:14LGBTQ movement and pride month on in the Chamber of Commerce
342. 27:19They're going to like freak out. Okay?
343. 27:22Pastor you can't freak out you have to empower your people to go out there and take biblical worldview
344. 27:30you into the marketplace and into your city. That's how we get the light. And oh, by the way,
345. 27:36people are not going to be convicted. The Holy Spirit's job description is to convict the world
346. 27:42of sin, righteousness and judgment. If they're not bringing the truth of the word of God, how are
347. 27:48people even going to be convicted of their sin? That's what the role of the Holy Spirit is. So
348. 27:53it's, it's, there's a whole bunch there, Alex, but we have to, number one, I want to tell people
349. 27:59love your pastor, they've got the hardest job on the planet. Walk beside them and
350. 28:05say I will be the one that will help you talk about these subjects and also work
351. 28:11to mobilize people in our congregation because I know you don't have the bandwidth.
352. 28:14Thirdly, just tell them we are going to support you and have your back if you get
353. 28:20out there on the water and talk about prayer voting engagement and issues. We
354. 28:24will have your back and we are going to support you and make sure that everybody
355. 28:28understands we stand with you. If we do that, we will see more pastors stand up, I believe.
356. 28:33I mean, you know, back in February, I was at NRB National Religious Broadcasters, which is
357. 28:39with AFR. We go there. It's the big gathering of broadcast ministries and it's talking to George
358. 28:46Barna, the Barna research group, very brilliant guy. And he was saying that, you know, like 82 to 85
359. 28:54percent of all parishioners want their clergy to speak about moral, social, political issues
360. 29:03from a biblical perspective. You know, what thus saith the Lord? And yet, and it varies, but somewhere
361. 29:11like three to seven percent max of clergy will, from the pulpit, in that posture of authority,
362. 29:21speak on record about moral social political issues.
363. 29:26And I would say to pastors, and hey, pastor,
364. 29:29I feel you're paying, I have pastored, I am a pastor,
365. 29:33I'm in a pulpit somewhere every week,
366. 29:35I understand the fine line of diplomacy
367. 29:39that you think you have to walk.
368. 29:40But here's the thing, 80% of your people in your pews
369. 29:44are ready and eager for you to speak on record
370. 29:49about moral social political issues.
371. 29:52And so I would say, like you said, the fear of man brings a snare,
372. 29:56the Bible says, but let's not be afraid.
373. 29:59Let's be obedient. That's what we're called to do, isn't it?
374. 30:02Well, and I'll say this, Alex, Gen Z,
375. 30:06they're leaving the church because it's not relevant to them because pastors are not
376. 30:10talking about anything that they need to hear from.
377. 30:13They're worried about pornography, they're worried about transgenderism,
378. 30:16They're worried about bullying, they're worried about suicide rates, you know, they're worried
379. 30:21about all this stuff and where are they listening?
380. 30:24The good thing is there are voices arising that are pushing young people back to the Bible
381. 30:30that are pushing people to stand up, you know, many of our friends in the movement that they're
382. 30:35listening to and going, oh, wow, if that guy has boldness, man, maybe I could get a little
383. 30:41bit of boldness.
384. 30:42But they're not hearing it from the American pulpit.
385. 30:45And so we have to really examine our hearts and go, what are we actually building here?
386. 30:51What are we actually doing here?
387. 30:53You know, if we're not leading people, this is my big message for my life, Alex, is if we're
388. 30:58not leading people back to intimacy with Jesus to the place of prayer, to the Word of God every
389. 31:04day to worship, and we're not teaching them how to walk with him and hear from him, how
390. 31:10do we expect them to be leaders in their generation or do anything?
391. 31:14We're not going to do anything.
392. 31:16So we have to disciple people.
393. 31:18That's not happening in the American church very much.
394. 31:22And then we have to push them out and support them and hold their hand when they go out there
395. 31:26to be leaders and mess up and fail and get muddy and, you know, we've got to walk with
396. 31:33them and be those, those pastors that help them in those, in those processes.
397. 31:38Well, and as Billy Graham said, once courage is contagious, you know, I mean, honestly,
398. 31:44we are bold and truthful and biblical. It will spread. Hey, we've got a brief break. We're
399. 31:52going to take calls. Now here's the number folks, triple eight, five, eight, nine, 8840. That's
400. 31:57eight, eight, eight, five, eight, nine, 8840. If you've got a question for Bunny Pounds or
401. 32:04myself, we would love to hear from you. Jesus and politics. Let's talk, Bunny, before this
402. 32:11brief commercial, give a website again to help people where they can find you online.
403. 32:16Yeah, Christiansengage.org. On that website, take the pledge to pray, vote, engage, and
404. 32:22grab my book at Amazon, Jesus and Politics.
405. 32:26Great. Hey, we've got a brief break. Alex McFarland here, the American Family Radio Network, your
406. 32:31calls, your questions, and more when we come back. Triple eight, five, eight, nine, eighty
407. 32:36eight, forty. Let us hear from you. We're back after this.
408. 33:09Thoughts of the child you were carrying,
409. 33:11keep poring over in your mind.
410. 33:13A deep, unrelenting sadness over shadows your days,
411. 33:17and you wonder if you will ever feel whole again.
412. 33:20There is hope and healing from a reproductive loss.
413. 33:24Call the International Helpline 866-482-LIFE
414. 33:29and talk with someone who has been where you are.
415. 33:32Your call is confidential,
416. 33:33and we will help you find healing.
417. 33:36866-482-LIFE.
418. 33:39So Middle East, that's one part of the world we need to pay attention to, especially the
419. 33:43country of Israel.
420. 33:44Each week, I hope you make sense of what's happening in that region through a biblical
421. 33:48lens.
422. 33:49I'll bring you important information about security threats, archaeological discoveries,
423. 33:52biblical prophecy, ministries happening on the ground, and much more.
424. 33:56I'm John Riley.
425. 33:57Join me for the Middle East Report Special Edition every Saturday at 6.30 PM Central on American
426. 34:02Family Radio as I connect you to the people, places, and geography of what we read in God's
427. 34:08word.
428. 34:13Hamilton Quarter Podcast and One-Minute Common Terrets are available at EFR.net.
429. 34:19Back to the Hamilton Quarter on American Family Radio.
430. 34:24Welcome back to the program.
431. 34:25Alex McFarland, very honored to be sitting in with Abe Hamilton, or for Abe Hamilton III.
432. 34:32He's an attorney, a pastor, and a broadcaster.
433. 34:36And I feel very privileged that he would entrust the Hamilton Corner microphone to me when he
434. 34:42is on the road.
435. 34:43So we're talking with Bunny Palms.
436. 34:46And by the way, this show, you can listen again at AFR.net.
437. 34:51Check out if you would the website and the app.
438. 34:54There's a station map to show where all of the American family stations are.
439. 34:59And then of course, people around the world listen online.
440. 35:02And maybe if you've got a friend that's kind of reticent to,
441. 35:08as a Christian, make their voice heard, this show might encourage them.
442. 35:12But, Bunny, thank you for being with us.
443. 35:14We're gonna go to some callers right now.
444. 35:17And by the way, if you have a question,
445. 35:18the number is 888-4888-40.
446. 35:23But we'll begin in Kentucky.
447. 35:25Jacob from Kentucky, welcome to the program.
448. 35:30Hey, bird, I enjoy your broadcast today.
449. 35:35Well, God bless you.
450. 35:35I'm gonna make a thorn in the words.
451. 35:37Thanks.
452. 35:38It's Alex here, actually, but thanks for listening.
453. 35:40I know who it is.
454. 35:42I got you that time didn't I?
455. 35:44You did, you did.
456. 35:46But thank you.
457. 35:47Hey, what's your question for Bunny and myself?
458. 35:50Hey, I'm currently unengaged in the political process period because I really don't see too
459. 36:04much difference between the two parties and the only time I ever hear anything about what
460. 36:14God or anything on programs like this and there's not very many of those I can tell you that.
461. 36:25And what would you have to say to people in that sort of situation?
462. 36:34Well, I have some thoughts. Thank you for asking. Thank you for your honesty.
463. 36:38Bunny, I kind of hear that sentiment sometimes. What would you say to this person?
464. 36:45Well, I'll tell you, Jesus is not on the ballot. Part of what we do with politics is choose between imperfect people.
465. 36:53But I would challenge you that there's not a lot of difference. There is great differences between the two party platforms and the values of different candidates.
466. 37:05And it doesn't take that far to look.
467. 37:09We put out a biblical roadmap to the party platforms,
468. 37:13which was 16 issues of what the Bible said on the topic,
469. 37:17what Marxism said on the topic,
470. 37:19and then the full platform playing
471. 37:22for the Republican Party and the Democrat Party
472. 37:24on those issues.
473. 37:27And yeah, I would love to get that to you
474. 37:31at Christiansengaged.org gets on our website,
475. 37:33but that would, I think would be a helpful tool for you to see,
476. 37:37but also, man, I know in 2020,
477. 37:40I'll just give you an example from my life,
478. 37:43our county judge shut down our whole county in Dallas County,
479. 37:47but right up the road, there was a county judge
480. 37:50that feared God and didn't shut down the county
481. 37:53and calling county in Plano and McKinney and Frisco.
482. 37:56And so for three weeks in our county,
483. 37:58we had to suffer under a county judge
484. 38:01that wanted to do something else.
485. 38:03So it really matters who you elect because they really affect your life even on a county and city level.
486. 38:10I'll just leave you with those thoughts.
487. 38:12Indeed, indeed. Thank you, Jacob.
488. 38:15Let's go to my home state of North Carolina.
489. 38:18Jessica from North Carolina.
490. 38:20Welcome to our conversation with Bunny Pound.
491. 38:23Hello, Jessica.
492. 38:28Hi, can you hear me?
493. 38:30Yes, now we can't. Thank you.
494. 38:32What you got?
495. 38:33So I just want to say this is my first time listening in.
496. 38:39So I just think it's been wonderful.
497. 38:43But the question that I do have is since God knows everything,
498. 38:48he sees all our days before, you know,
499. 38:52the numbers of hairs on our head are people predestined to
500. 38:59for hell.
501. 39:02Let me jump in on this and then, Bunny, you can weigh in as well.
502. 39:07And thank you so much, Jessica, for a great question.
503. 39:09No, I do not believe that anyone is predestined by God for hell.
504. 39:16Sometimes that's called double election.
505. 39:18Throughout the Bible, God says, whosoever will may come.
506. 39:23I think about Isaiah 55, 1 through 7, whosoever will may take
507. 39:28of the bread of life and Revelation 22 ends, whosoever will may come to the water of life.
508. 39:35And Jesus said in John 3, 16, to Nicodemus, whoever believes in Him.
509. 39:41So here's the thing, Jesus' death on the cross makes salvation possible.
510. 39:48But our response to Christ makes salvation actual.
511. 39:53I really do think salvation is offered to all people, not sadly, not all except Christ,
512. 40:00some reject the light they've been given.
513. 40:03But I personally believe, Jessica, that whoever will turn to Christ in faith, whoever that's
514. 40:12who can be saved, anyone.
515. 40:14Now that's a long topic.
516. 40:17And I believe me, I realize there's so much on this.
517. 40:20Let me recommend a book from my mentor in grad school.
518. 40:24He was a very close personal friend.
519. 40:25He's in heaven now, Norm Geisler, G-E-I-S-L-E-R, brilliant scholar.
520. 40:32I could do a whole program on that man's credentials.
521. 40:35But Dr. Geisler wrote a book called Chosen But Free.
522. 40:41What does it mean that we're chosen in Christ yet we have free will and we are responsible
523. 40:46to make a choice?
524. 40:48but free is a great book on that subject.
525. 40:50Thank you, Jessica.
526. 40:51Let's go to Virginia, Mark in Virginia,
527. 40:54where we'll be doing a youth camp in Virginia,
528. 40:57but Mark, are you there?
529. 40:59I'm there.
530. 41:00Can you hear me?
531. 41:01We can hear you.
532. 41:02Welcome.
533. 41:04Thank you.
534. 41:05I met you before at a proof for youth thing
535. 41:10I took my youngest son to, but I'm sure
536. 41:12you don't remember anyways.
537. 41:15What I found is that those churches that stand for truth have no problems filling the pews.
538. 41:26And one of the things that I do with pastors is I take them to John 10.
539. 41:32And I say the sheep hear the shepherd's voice. But when the wolves come, the hired hands run away.
540. 41:39So what are you, pastor? Are you a shepherd? Are you a hired hand?
541. 41:44Wow, good stuff. Hey, Bunny, isn't it true? The more theologically and politically conservative
542. 41:52a church is, the more those are the churches that are growing. Oh, it's absolutely true.
543. 41:58You see the mainline denominations continuing to lose members as pulpits remain silent on
544. 42:06a lot of topics in the evangelical world. There's definitely more growth. Yeah, people, especially
545. 42:142020, Alex, I mean, we saw a mass exodus from certain churches and a lot of growth in some
546. 42:21other churches because of the boldness of pastors to keep churches open or to speak the truth related
547. 42:28to what was happening. So people are looking for that. I've seen more people switch churches in the
548. 42:33last five years than I think my entire lifetime. And I challenge people, you know, you got to really
549. 42:39look at who your shepherds are and where your tithe money is going too. Are you supporting
550. 42:45people that are actually preaching the truth and love? Yes. George in Kentucky, George,
551. 42:52are you there? Hello, hello. Welcome. Can you hear me? Hi, I have a question for you and
552. 43:00bunny. I want to give you my opinion of the three most important things in life. And then
553. 43:11I would like to hear your opinion of the three most important things in life and how God applies
554. 43:20to those three things. I think the three most important things are in this order, security
555. 43:29health and finance and I would like to know what you think. I mean this is
556. 43:36overall out of everything your whole life I would like to know what you think the
557. 43:40three most important things are and then how God applies to those. Thank you for
558. 43:47the question I'm gonna jump in and I'm gonna throw it to my to I think the three
559. 43:52most important things in life and number one our salvation that we are born again
560. 43:58because eternity itself hangs on that.
561. 44:01Then I think stewardship of one's life,
562. 44:04because 1 Corinthians 6, 19, and 20 says that
563. 44:08we are not our own, that we are responsible
564. 44:11to the God who made us and the Savior who redeemed us.
565. 44:16So we're to be stewards of our life.
566. 44:19And then the final thing, I believe,
567. 44:21is involvement in Christ's Great Commission.
568. 44:25The Bible tells the church to go into all the world mark 16 15 Matthew 28 18 through 20 and let me just say
569. 44:32There has never been an engine that has done the most good for the most people
570. 44:38Like the United States and I've traveled to third world countries and when I'm deep in the interior of Africa or South America
571. 44:47And I find people that have food a well
572. 44:52literacy, schools, hospitals, it always, it doesn't matter anywhere you go on the
573. 44:59globe when you find the betterment of the human condition. It was done by
574. 45:04American Christian entities. So those are my three bunny. What do you say to the
575. 45:10caller? That's some good three. I was thinking as he was talking, my number one
576. 45:15is to know God and Jesus Christ whom he sent, John 17. I think that's my
577. 45:21ultimate calling in life is to know God intimately. Number two, relationships,
578. 45:27you know, the first and second commandment is to love God with all our heart, soul,
579. 45:31mind and strength, love our neighbor as ourself. And then I'll piggyback on
580. 45:35your Zalix of stewardship with the gospel. I'll put that in the third category,
581. 45:40which is stewardship of our gifts and talents and our life for the propagation of the gospel and
582. 45:45in the kingdom of God would be my three the way I laid out.
583. 45:49But all of those are important.
584. 45:51But again, loving God and loving our neighbors is really how we're working all that out
585. 45:57in our individual lives.
586. 45:59And George, hear me out.
587. 46:00I say this very respectfully and humbly.
588. 46:04Security, health and finance.
589. 46:06I'm with you.
590. 46:07Those matter.
591. 46:08But Jesus asked the question, what does it profit a man to gain the whole world but lose
592. 46:11his soul?
593. 46:13You could be healthy and wealthy, but still be lost.
594. 46:17And so the beautiful thing, C.S. Lewis once said this, grasp earth and you'll miss heaven.
595. 46:24Plus you'll lose earth because we're all going to die.
596. 46:26But if you take the hand of Christ, Matthew 6, 33, the Lord said, seek first the kingdom
597. 46:34of God and His righteousness and all these other things be added to you.
598. 46:39God knows that we desire security, we want to be healthy, and we have financial needs.
599. 46:46The Lord knows that.
600. 46:48And the beautiful thing that Christ promised, and I would just encourage you on my own website,
601. 46:54AlexMcFarlane.com.
602. 46:55There's a tab, What Does God Say About My Relationship With Him?
603. 46:59Please read that.
604. 47:00And trust Jesus, and you'll get those other physical needs that you're thinking about as
605. 47:06well.
606. 47:07We've got time, I think, for one more call.
607. 47:09Let's go to Patty from Iowa.
608. 47:11Patty, are you there?
609. 47:13Yes.
610. 47:14Welcome to our conversation with Bunny Pounds.
611. 47:16Thank you.
612. 47:19I live in a town of about 11,000.
613. 47:21There is a college here which always makes it a little more livable, but Iowa is basically
614. 47:27conservative and Republican.
615. 47:29They announced in the paper a couple months ago that for the first time they made it like
616. 47:35it was a good thing.
617. 47:37They were going to have gay pride parade in Waverly or LGBT pride parade.
618. 47:45And I haven't seen anything in the paper since then of anyone doing anything to try to prevent
619. 47:50that.
620. 47:51And I'm not in very good health myself.
621. 47:54I don't always make it to chill, but I doubt if any of the past trees, I don't know what
622. 48:03to do about it or if there's anything that gunners should be done about it.
623. 48:07I thank you for your concern.
624. 48:15Bunny, do you have any advice for people maybe in a similar situation?
625. 48:21Here comes the LGBTQ trans pride parades.
626. 48:26And what can or should people do about that?
627. 48:30Yeah, well, you know, we've got free speech, of course, but we also should be bold in our
628. 48:36faith.
629. 48:37And I have a really great friend, Wade Aaron, he takes a cross and walks across the country,
630. 48:42know, and brings the gospel into those places. And I would, I would suggest that if it's happening
631. 48:49and you can't do anything to stop it, go out there and love on people. Talk to them. You're
632. 48:55gonna find backslidden Christians. You're gonna find wounded people. You're gonna find
633. 49:00people that need Jesus. But then, you know, have somebody in your town write an op-ed to
634. 49:06the, to the paper. Ask people to write letters to the city council and make your voice be heard
635. 49:12that you might not want that next year.
636. 49:14Yeah, and you know, let me say these nervous,
637. 49:17Nelly city administrators that grant a prayed permit
638. 49:21to really 1% of the population when 98 and a half percent
639. 49:27are probably conservative Christian, heterosexual.
640. 49:32You know, we can make our voice heard,
641. 49:34and I believe we should.
642. 49:35Bunny Pounds, thank you for being with us tonight.
643. 49:39The views and opinions expressed in this broadcast
644. 49:42may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family Association or American Family Radio.